[samb123]

A few points...

No pvp without a dm. Period.

I do not think the server is mature enough to handle this.

I disagree. You know how this gets handled on servers with successful PvP rules?
1) Openly insulting and/or provoking someone is an open invitation to PvP. (Why? Because people often try to hide behind PvP rules as a way to avoid maintaining IC civility and then prevent retaliation.)
2) DMs and Players start saying, "NO fussing when you lose, absolutely none." (No one whines. Whiners get reprimanded by DMs.)
3) The loser of any PvP encounter is ruled to have their memory wiped of anything hostile during the last 24 hours. (In other words, you remember that really cool and useful (for a quest, for example), but your character can't remember the PvP encounter.)

PvP guidelines need to be in place. Being able to engage in bad behavior (IC or OOC) is not something rules should allow.

In my humble opinion monsters should be KoS (and be able to KoS others) with no DM oversight needed.

Yes. Monster race players are aware of what they signed up for, frankly.

Players should never have a say in perma or not, unless they are making that decision for their own character.

I agree. No player should be able to perma-kill any character but their own.

Some take it to the point that they just piss off allot of people and then they get hunted down and results in perma one way or another.

So? Let them get hunted down. Grab a DM, and let them organize things such that a perma can be handed out, if appropriate. If you piss everyone off and only cause damage and chaos and generally be an asshat IC, the consequence might just be that they eventually kill your character.

but in my anecdotal experience the people who wish to remain outside of PvP often use this excuse to be openly IC insulting, provocative and degrading to other party while using their desire to stay clear of PvP as a screen to avoid consequence.

I've also seen this on other servers. Fact is, if you were IC insulting, provocative, and/or degrading in real life, it causes issues. (Fight starts [hopefully not], the thrower of insults get reported to HR, etc., etc., etc.) In a setting like Netheril, openly insulting someone is asking for a consequence... such as a duel. 
And from a mechanical perspective, maybe, just maybe, that loss of xp if you lose the duel will teach you to be more careful who you pick IC fights with. 

[ToxicWrench]

I disagree. You know how this gets handled on servers with successful PvP rules?
1) Openly insulting and/or provoking someone is an open invitation to PvP. (Why? Because people often try to hide behind PvP rules as a way to avoid maintaining IC civility and then prevent retaliation.)
2) DMs and Players start saying, "NO fussing when you lose, absolutely none." (No one whines. Whiners get reprimanded by DMs.)
3) The loser of any PvP encounter is ruled to have their memory wiped of anything hostile during the last 24 hours. (In other words, you remember that really cool and useful (for a quest, for example), but your character can't remember the PvP encounter.)

PvP guidelines need to be in place. Being able to engage in bad behavior (IC or OOC) is not something rules should allow

This is what we had initially, more or less. And it didn't work.

When the entire DM team has to stop what they're working on and deal with the fallout of a single PvP encounter for days at a time, dealing with dramatics, tears and rage quits. Something isn't working.

So as the others have said, until everyone learns to play nice and start acting like PvP is part of the game not a personal attack, we have our current rules.

[Cptzambie]

I tried another server and there players were mature and welcomed non moderated pvp with opened arms. I hope one day our players will mature since this is just a game at the end of the day if you char gets beaten down for in char things then so what it adds to your characters story.

[granny]

Maybe it would help if we were willing to open up our view on what PvP interaction might actually mean. If we think that it is an interaction that is more than the possible draining of HP, it would be clear for us that PvP already started when you decide, for instance, to:

• openly provoke/ insult a PC, be it through words or be it through actions that could end up enraging them;
• steal/ pick pocket someone;
• be hostile to a player and let your familiar to harass them for you.

Le us not not mistake arguments/ discussion/ altercation with provoking/ insulting beyond reason although. The line is blurred, I know, but there is a line that separate such. Common sense helps here.

At my first days here I honestly liked it a lot the current ruling of "no PvP without DM supervision". More on my general agreement that the playerbase although very inspired and creative still lacked some maturity indeed. I was relieved that I would not have to worry to be alone in a PvP here without the supervision of papa and mommy. That said, as I have spent more time here with this ruling, it came to me that it had a very interesting and refreshing (probably unexpected at the start) outcome: this has been forcing players to figure out how to generate and solve conflicts between their characters without going straight forward to the skull-bashing-and-kill solution. These almost two months that I have spent here allowed me to notice that several PCs have a long term conflict going on and their relationships had the time to build up and become really complex. This probably would not be possible if they were up to solve it "easily" by the tip of a sword or of a "Slay Living" weaving.

[Fiona Voust]

I want to take part in this discussion to offer a point and in my opinion the biggest point and most important of all.

PVP on this server simply can't work because there's huge imbalances in character power.

There's characters who've been around for almost a year and are near lvl 20, showered in DM loot and can one shoot you.
No matter your skill in pvp there's no way you can have a chance beat such a character unless you wait to gear up and get levels which makes the RP -stale and boring- much like Arelith is in my opinion.

Unless there's some kind of balance in power for the majority of the playerbase like EFU has because it's a pvp server, pvp can't happen.

[Orcslayer]

i Disagree Considering it doesn't take too long to get high lvl without power questing here. Also every server has characters that are stronger because they have been around for awhile pretty hard to stop that just have to think outside the box to bring them down. A lvl 11 can beat a lvl 20 if they wanted to...

[edmaster44]

PVP should be the resort of in character actions that causes a reaction, I'm past the point in my nwn career that i really don't give a toss about what happens to my character. But requiring DM to Monitor Pvp is a bit extreme and in many cases, it sort of leads to this stagnation in character development and causes a weird camp fire, hug box effect that makes server stagnate, seen it happened before, I've been playing nwn for over a decade, lay down some ground work, promote a friend open minded culture that isn't afraid of conflict and reduce the OOC that spreads when Character A beat down B, that causes even MORE drama. 

[Tyrael]

I want to take part in this discussion to offer a point and in my opinion the biggest point and most important of all.

PVP on this server simply can't work because there's huge imbalances in character power.

There's characters who've been around for almost a year and are near lvl 20, showered in DM loot and can one shoot you.
No matter your skill in pvp there's no way you can have a chance beat such a character unless you wait to gear up and get levels which makes the RP -stale and boring- much like Arelith is in my opinion.

Unless there's some kind of balance in power for the majority of the playerbase like EFU has because it's a pvp server, pvp can't happen.

In my 8 years of playing persistent worlds of NWN I have only won a major PvP plot with mechanical power twice.  All the other victories I have revolve around long term planning and executing intrigue which undermined the power base of the character we were targeting and eventually lead to their fall.  A level 1 CAN defeat a level 20 in PvP, but they aren't going to do it in a fair, toe-to-toe fight. 

[Grim]

The funny thing is that several of the highest level players have only had those characters for a few months no way near a year. You cant expect players that only log a few hours a day or a week will be near those that play 40 plus hours a week. Should we punish those players that take time to develop their characters in favor of those casual players just be cause they feel left behind.

[SpiffyHas]

Every game has a time investment = reward mechanic. The more time you can play, the more powerful or equipped or friends you have.

That's every game.